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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2016 18:12:33 GMT
John - I think the title of this thread should give you all the clues you need to work out what this thread is about, and what people are discussing & giving their opinions on. Most on here seem to think we will make the play offs, my opinion is, we will not.
You can continue to pick on my posts & comments if you like, but i've grown rather tired of it all.
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Post by back4more on Mar 30, 2016 18:28:30 GMT
Not picking on your posts at all Paul. Just drawing the distinction between optimism and conviction.
Like most others I am optimistic (cautiously) but not convinced that we will do it.
Sorry if that doesn't fit the thread subject heading sufficiently to your liking.
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Post by michaelefc on Mar 30, 2016 19:30:06 GMT
IMO we focus on beating Guiseley. Do that and then focus on the next one. Can we reach the play offs? Yes of course we can. Can we fail to reach the play offs? Yes of course we can. Can we beat Guiseley? Yes of course we can, so lets just do it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2016 20:10:58 GMT
I am pretty much of the same opinion as Sattsy on a few points.
I am a realist and I bet 100% that as soon as it goes pear shaped with a couple of defeats everyone will be jumping on the bandwagon. In my opinion we are playing no better now winning, than we were in defeat, results are just going our way against more winnable opposition and we have gone to grinding out a result at the 'business end' of the season. If people are happy how we are playing now then I expect to see no criticism once the defeats come along, but the reverse of opinions will commence, as people follow the bandwagon.
In my opinion, we are papering over massive cracks, and reaching the play offs, no matter how much I want the club to go up, will kill us for next season if we reach the play offs and don't go up. There will be no massive overhaul in the squad, everything is rosy, and we waste another season next year playing the same, disjointed, and I cant believe I am about to say this, no better football than under Hill. I was not a Hill style football fan.
For me, it is not all about the 3 points, it is how you go about obtaining them. If this wasn't the business end of the season and was earlier on in the season people would be saying how mundane the football is, but because it is only the result that matters at the moment it has become acceptable.
However, the above does not matter anyway as I don't think we make the play offs and wholesale squad changes has to happen in the summer, as does our playing philosophy if we are to continue to attract fans off the pitch and progress on it.
Ill say this now rather than be a bandwagon jumper later on, but unfortunately I think the manager has to change, and if it does, I hope we go back in and request permission to speak to Steve Burr. I dont think Todd helped himself in January and I dont think he has helped himself with the style that has been reverted to as of late as it will not be to many peoples liking.
By the way, this is a fans forum and if the players and manager need to see positive comments on here then we seriously have bigger problems on the field. People have opinions and they may not be what you want to hear, or agree with.
The win win situation is we do go up, but for me its not a win situation losing in the play offs, so I hope we win them for reasons stated above.
I'll await the abuse.......
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Post by michaelefc on Mar 31, 2016 7:17:17 GMT
For me, it is not all about the 3 points, it is how you go about obtaining them.
No abuse I just don't agree with you. Whether we finish 4th or 8th, I don't think cracks will be papered over at all. The fact is this team is not good enough. Assuming we don't go up, and I do assume that, it is clear we need to substantially change the squad for next season, and I am sure we will do. However, now is not the time to be thinking about this, now is the time to be beating Guiseley, a crappy streaky 1-0 will do just fine.
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Post by erc on Mar 31, 2016 8:07:12 GMT
If we are (possibly) achieving play offs but (I agree) papering over the cracks this season, does that mean it will take few changes next season or massive changes.
I am more than happy to have Chris Todd as manager for the next season , the only thing he has disappointed me in has been the signings loan and/or permanent ones. Very few - maybe just Coulson, have been quality additions, and at quite an expense.
I think the club needs to say they've achieved play offs twice in a row to become an easier sell to new players, but ultimately we are fighting for promotion against two Ex - league clubs and a club with even more money than us (massively in debt though) and a really self centred owner, so it's not an embarrassment to come 4th or even 7th with some of the names in this league.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 8:51:09 GMT
Good post yet again SS.
You are right that whilst we scrape an ugly 1-0 win, people will say oh it's the end of the season, we just need to win any way we can and get 3 points in any way we can, i dont care if we play hoofball etc. They are happy saying that whilst we win 1-0 or scrape 0-0 draws against a team 2nd from bottom who play with 10 men for 70 mins. However, as you state, it wont be long until those same people turn on the manager and team saying we are crap when we lose 0-1 & 0-4 against better teams. Then they will be requesting wholesale changes and will no doubt turncoat and say they knew deep down all along that we wouldn't do it anyway. That's why i have been staying away from EFC lately, i cannot stand to hear those idiots shouting out stuff during games. They are clueless. There are quite a few very knowledgeable fans at this wonderful club, but for every 1 of them, there are now 30 that haven't the foggiest and they are now ruining our reputation. Then they come on hear and spout nonsense...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 9:00:14 GMT
If we are (possibly) achieving play offs but (I agree) papering over the cracks this season, does that mean it will take few changes next season or massive changes. I am more than happy to have Chris Todd as manager for the next season , the only thing he has disappointed me in has been the signings loan and/or permanent ones. Very few - maybe just Coulson, have been quality additions, and at quite an expense. I think the club needs to say they've achieved play offs twice in a row to become an easier sell to new players, but ultimately we are fighting for promotion against two Ex - league clubs and a club with even more money than us (massively in debt though) and a really self centred owner, so it's not an embarrassment to come 4th or even 7th with some of the names in this league. Spot on ERC. One thing to add comment to....You are right that its no embarrassment to finish 7th, finishing 7th doesn't embarrass me at all, i think 7th is about where we are with this manager & squad. However, i just wonder how SD feels. He wont be embarrassed, but i suspect the budget we have had, puts us in 2nd-3rd place, so does he see this season as a failure based on budget, or does he see it as another season of growth & development? From what i know of SD, and i dont get to see or talk to him much these days, he certainly wanted promo this year and believed at the start of the season, we would be good enough with a good enough budget to have a genuine shot at winning the league. I know he gets twitchy & restless at the end of a season & in the pre-season, because he's a workaholic who rarely experiences failure in his life. So i just wonder how this season will effect him and i wonder if he will really go for it next year, making huge changes, versus a few tweaks here and there. As i have said before, we need a complete overhaul and i would only retain about 8 of the squad. Next season, really could be the year of change and the year we finally make it up. However, even if we make huge changes and still come up short, i for one, will never be embarrassed, as i will know we went for it and tried our best. Some of our fans are bloody embarrassing at times, but i'm told that's progress..
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 9:51:39 GMT
Why await abuse SunnySaturdays for expressing your opinion? Football fans are fickle, most roll with the wins, then turn round when they lose and pick holes in the team and manager...that's life. For what its worth I agree with you, we have been papering over massive cracks. Last season was our first in this league and we did fantastically well. Where we went wrong was not building on it last summer with a clear out. Whether people like it or not we failed to gain promotion even if it was an unexpected opportunity so the team needed to be improved. We kept most of them and also kept a small size squad in order to keep 17/18 players happy rather than having 21/22 and a few sulking. The results speak for themselves, we're off the pace, we were one of the title favourites before we kicked off this season. The football we're playing is indeed mundane, and it won't build our fan base. One fan wisecracked at half time against Welling last week that he was worried social services might accuse him of cruelty to his daughter by letting her watch that half!!! As regards the manager has to change that's right, replace him, its not worked out and if he stays I fear most of our current squad will stay too because he said "If the player coming in is not better or as good as what I have already I don't want them" And this squad has failed. We need to go with a 3 year plan from this summer, to rebuild, create a young squad who will play for the badge with pride and passion. I'd be happy with a top half finish next season, building the team, preparing for a title challenge the following year. Of course if they challenged next season that would be a bonus, but lets not fall into the trap of taking one step forward and then two back. SD is possibly a man in a hurry to get there, the promised land, but he knows better than anyone that the foundations must be built first and he is doing that very well off the pitch. Its easy for any of us to spend his money, I bang on about John Akinde and Bondz N'Gala from Barnet, but those two and somehow keeping Matt Tubbs makes me believe we would have the nucleus of a championship winning side, imagine how strong the defence would be..Poke, Partington, Turley, N'Gala, and Harding, we play 4-3-3 or 4-4-2 with Tubbs and Akinde up top. Thats my opinion and I'm sure everyboby has different views. If we did go up this season, and its a big if, we will struggle next seaon if we keep this squad virtually intact so it is better really to not make it. I personally don't think we'll get there into the PO, and even if we do I can't see us overturning Cheltenham, Forest Green or Grimsby over two legs, especially with us having to play at home first, yes we beat Cheltenham 1-0 with an own goal, Yes we beat Forest Green 3-2 with an injury time winner, but a one goal cushion is not enough, as for Grimsby they'll play us off the park anyway in both games.
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Post by erc on Mar 31, 2016 10:03:09 GMT
I think next season will be great if FGR (who always buy up / splash the cash at consistent periods through the season each season) and Cheltenham go up, that will play into our hands. Grimsby cannot keep going for it all the time (although it took Luton 5 years) and I find it hard to see them pushing for it next season if they stay in this division.
The two teams York and Dagenham really don't scare me, coming up Ebbsfleet who are absolutely doing a Bromley at the moment + 1 other won't be hitting the play off heights straight away and from Conference North it's only really Fylde who have money to waste.
So I think the league will be an easier prospect next season, although Tranmere might be a better club as a whole (with the FL parachute payments ! )
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Post by hantslondoner on Mar 31, 2016 10:22:37 GMT
You could argue that we've suffered from 'second season syndrome'. Other teams have got used to our style, and players, and prepared accordingly. That's one reason we should have changed the squad more both before the season and in January.
I think we slightly overachieved last season, and this season has been marred by two major blips in form (one was when RH left). And/or the post-Bolton 'reaction'. Bearing in mind those blips in form I think we've done OK. I said we'd finish 5-7 and we probably will. If people are complaining about the way we're playing at the moment, I think it is a response to the awful state of our pitch. A pragmatic style. And W3 D1 in the last 4 is OK. We tried to pass it in the second half against Welling and the ball kept bobbling or slowing down in the sand.
As for next season.... let's see who's left in the division. I agree neither Daggers nor York would be fearsome, despite the increased parachute payments, but then I didn't think Cheltenham would do as well as they did. For me, whichever of Grimsby or Tranmere are left will be the team to beat.
As for us.... not sure. I think whether we get in the playoffs or not may determine CT's future, and for me it's still in the balance. Our run-in still isn't bad on paper.
We need to look at the reasons for our two major blips in form and identify the players who have not performed consistently this season. There are a few.....
Any reason why N'Gala and Akinde would want to drop a league to play for us, when they're doing well at Barnet? I think N'Gala should be playing higher than League Two. And he's only 26. As is Akinde. I think Tubbs has shown nothing yet to justify our trying to get him for next season. And I thought he was a good signing when we got him. You might argue that it's the players around him that are lacking, but they can't all be bad. After all, we were still around the top 5 when Tubbs arrived....
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 10:34:16 GMT
I don't think Ebbsfleet will win the Conf South, 2 teams can catch them now, and i think Sutton definitely will catch them. However, they have a 3G pitch, so not sure how their promo works, if they do win it? But yes i agree if Cheltenham and FGR do go up, then i think the league will be a weaker one next season, which should give us a better chance. But for me, its all about the squad we put together next season. I'm ok with Toddy staying, but he drastically needs to improve on his recruitment. As i have said many times, its the one massive black mark against him and it will remain until he signs at least 4 players who start games week in week out and improve what we have. Improving our bench does nothing for me, and Coulsen aside (although i'm still yet to see what all the fuss is about), that's all his signings have even been, bench warmers and we already had better bench warmers that we sent out on loan.. If Toddy was to leave the club, then we need an experienced man with far better contacts than these younger managers appear to have. I'm all for giving younger guys a chance, but they haven't built up the footballing networks that the older guys have, and that's why we have seen some very poor players come in and then leave very quickly, and some even without playing a game, which is bloody embarrassing!
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Post by back4more on Mar 31, 2016 10:41:35 GMT
After watching another couple of games affected by poor playing conditions, especially at Torquay on Monday after the deluge when so many other matches were cancelled, I am really looking forward to seeing how the side play as the pitches improve. I have been to every match over the last few months (and through most of the season). What we have seen in the last couple of months is tactical success in getting the points when relying totally on good football hasn't been an option. We have put some passages of excellent play together in every match but we've also seen passes go astray and also possession lost when physical challenges on poor surfaces have won out over skill and guile. You can't, unfortunately, keep playing the ball out from the back and through the midfield when there isn't a good footing and the ball comes off the pitch at all angles and speeds. The only option is to make best use of the conditions to catch the opposition out and we have managed to do that. That's just sensible tactics and it has seen the ball in the air or going long more often than you'd always want. The test of quality will come, hopefully, as the pitches dry out and can be repaired.
As for recruitment of players, we know the club wanted to bring more players in but from comments Chris Todd has made in various interviews it seems that hasn't been feasible. The indication has been that the January transfer market and the mid season loan market are awash with overvalued players with inflated wage demands. In reality anyone can sign an overpriced player but that is the road to disaster - just ask Brendan Rogers. Closer to home, I remember Ian Baird signing a host of highly rated players and getting little return in terms of performances or results.
When seen in that context, the recovery we've seen from the barren spell that followed the post Bolton Wanderers' hangover can be particularly appreciated. Even if we don't make the play offs, I would regard what has been achieved over the last seven games as evidence enough of Chris Todd's managerial credentials. It can be argued that his initial remarkable turn around in the team's fortunes, after the losing streak which Richard Hill had suffered (which coincided almost exactly with Andy Drury's leave of absence at the time btw) could be attributed partly to "new manager bounce" and perhaps also to the return of AD to the side. The FA Cup run was however exceptional by any standards and could not have been achieved with a less capable manager at the helm. Nor would we have been able to come back from that lean spell after going out of the cup without very strong management.
CT has certainly made mistakes but he has been able to learn from them and as he has grown into the job Eastleigh have been the beneficiary. When a manager goes out of the door he takes important experience of managing at the club and working with the owner with him. That's why I was very afraid when we lost Richard, apart from the fact that I thought he was a stand out manager in his own right. Stewart's decision to maintain the line of succession with CT has proved to be the right one in my opinion and has provided a foundation for us to make all the progress he might wish for next season whether in this league or League 2.
Looking to the next season, CT is in the ideal position with his knowledge and appraisal of the current squad to be able to plan for the future and to decide where he needs to strengthen the side in order to build his own team.
I'm not sure whether SS's suggestion of Steve Burr as a potential future Eastleigh manager is serious but there seems to be a hint there that the club has tried to talk to him before. Don't know anything about him and hopefully the situation won't arise where the club would want to try to talk to him now.
I can't think of any other club where supporters would be advocating a change of manager when they are moving up the table towards a top five place after winning four out of five matches (and 6 out of 7) with the possible exceptions of Chelsea, Manchester United and Arsenal.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 11:35:10 GMT
I don't think calling for a managers head is that rare when clubs are winning games. Aswell as the 3 clubs you mention, you could argue that the managers of the likes of Aston Villa (Sherwood), Swansea (Monk) & Derby (Clement) to name just 3 more, were all managing clubs whose expectation was perhaps rather higher than it really should have been. However, the chairmen of those clubs have all chosen to change managers when the general feelings were that their managers were actually doing quite well, or, were on the cusp of turning things around. The problem with clubs like those, and its no different at Eastleigh, is that its the "expectation" that fans & chairmen base their "the manager stays or goes" opinions on. Every season, we are one of the favourites to win the league. It was the same last season, same this season, and will be the same next season. So if it looks like we are not going to gain promotion, people will always blame and turn on the manager. because he hasn't achieved their expectation of getting promotion. It may not always be the managers fault, but he will get the blame. At this club, no one is ever going to turn on SD or the BoD because they give us everything and more, so it's always going to all be down to the manager. So in truth, at Eastleigh FC, the managers job is harder than it is at most other clubs in this league, because for some reason, we have this expectation to win it or at the very least get promotion via the play offs. That really is a massive task, no matter what budget you have and no matter what manager you have. Many ex FL teams have tried it year after year and they still haven't achieved it. So in truth, why are our expectations even that high? Perhaps we need to dampen it all down a bit & give Toddy the time he needs to learn the job, because he is still learning and still has lots to learn. Don't expect him to get this team performing miracle results week in week out. We are always going to lose at least 2 or 3 matches in every 10, so lets not go overboard when we scrape a 0-0 against 10 men, or win 1-0 against a team in the bottom 3, & equally, lets not start calling for Toddys head when we lose 2 more games in the next 6.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2016 12:14:31 GMT
My expectations are not based on league position, achieving promotion etc etc
I base solely on my viewing pleasure, not results. I fully understand that result of course do matter, but id rather watch football I enjoy and finish mid table than watch football I dont enjoy and lose in the play offs.
I can only base it on what I enjoy personally, so I cant knock Todd for results, I just havent enjoyed the football, 3pts or not. This is why it does not matter if I say if winning or losing, my enjoyment has been the same.
With regards to Burr example. My opinion is based solely on how I have seen his team play, both recently, and in the past. I have great respect for someone who sticks to footballing principles, even when losing, and he has done magnificent jobs on very tight budgets wherever he has been.
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